Decrease all mining cycles to 15 seconds.
Decrease all mining yields to compensate.
Remove auto-repeat from mining modules.

Mining. Now with more interactivity.

This is an interesting variation on "Miners will quit the game if "x". Well played.

Still, ores were already fairly interactive to mine compared to ice because they were already depletable while ice wasn't.

Oh noes! Cheaper ships at the cost of slightly more expensive fuel!

Interactivity in mining will do this game some good because a higher barrier to success adds value to the profession.

Introducing!

CAPTCHA MINING!!!

I assume you mean "interacting with other players while mining is nothing but detrimental". Mostly true. Very very occasionally you see "x up for free orca boosts". But paranoia limits even this level of interaction. And if you were to make the offer it does help others strip the system of ore that could otherwise be yours.

AFK ice mining is really no different from botting

Nobody is "wrong" in that situation.

If you watched CCP Soundwave today during his "couch chat", he made it quite clear that he's happy when players take matters into their own hands and play the way they want to. So if dude wants to mine and be a mouthy tard but, as a result, you decided to shoot him in the face then "The Powers That Be" are happy it's working that way.

Interactivity driven by players.

Interesting read OP and I can understand where you are coming from. However as a miner myself I have to say I hope there is more interactivity in mining. It doesn't have to be much, but somthing to stop the AFK miners getting just as much as me as someone who is always at my keyboard. I think mining rocks is reasonably good right now (they run out so quick when you are using a mack or hulk so you need to switch targets), but ice mining should never have been made the way it is now. It's almost better to be AFK with ice at the moment.

That'd be a start.

There's a difference between "I have more cargo capacity so you don't NEED to jet with a dedicated hauler" and "I got this, go watch TV for half an hour"

Here's a crazy idea. What if you cut that ore bay in half. You still have 17.5km3. Make the skiff like 10 instead of the current 15. Drop the T1 barges accordingly. That would be a start.

I really don't see any reason for a dedicated mining ship to hold one and a quarter jetcans of cargo and surpass the capacity of dedicated haulers. That's a max skill, cargo fitted and rigged mammoth using giant containers worth of space. That's as much as a cargo expanded and rigged Occator/Impel, the T2 transports with the largest potential cargo bays.

A higher barrier to success adds value to the mining profession.

Value = Demand / Supply.

You mean like the Hulk is now?

That information is literally four months old and was released shortly after the changes featured in Retribution.

There were a lot of Hulks left over. Their relevancy continues to decline.

By the way, enjoy the 45 minute hands-free mining times while they last.

Apparently, my equation isn't so irrelevant after all!

The fundamental idea of parking ship in space for hours on end while non-interactive modules cycle is just flawed. I don't think it could be salvaged. Fixing mining for good would require a grand overhaul that just isn't going to happen.

At best, I see CCP implementing some type of mining minigame, that effectively makes you be ATK doing something for max yield.

The equation's relevant, Dave. They're changing ice mining because of it.

Thanks for your unfinformed disagreement.

Key question - is the efficiency the point?

How efficient is the hulk that gets their can stolen? I always saw it as something you "ship down" into when jet mining is not safe or you have a fleet too small to warrant a dedicated hauler.

Is being at the keyboard with a jetting hulk becoming more efficient than afk printing isk into an oversized hold, not the whole point?

Why should jet canning with a paper tank hulk NOT be more efficient?
Why does a Mining ship need to haul more than a dedicated T2 hauler?

I just woke up. What did the presentation say?

I didn't say remove, I said cut it in half to start. 17km is still a sizeable hold that can be used to mine without jet canning and offers an advantage over the hulk in niche usability, like the skiff's tank. A solo mack vs a solo jetting hulk docking to get a hauler, the mack would still be similar in efficiency while being easier and safer in many ways. For one, try jet mining while orbiting to avoid bumpers.

Mining ships are supposed to mine. Transport ships are supposed to move goods. The mack largely obsoletes the use of transports to move ore/ice to station. Why would you have a hauler move ice mined by an active hulk to station, when a yield fit afk Mack has 92% of the iced yield and the same cargo space as an Occator with two cargo rigs and 6 cargo expander 2's?

Why does a mining ship with the second best yield need a cargo hold that matches the largest, max cargo fitted transport ship short of a Freighter/Orca?